Tantei Opera Milky Holmes - Star Crossed Anime Blog : Star Crossed Anime Blog
Posted on 22 March 2012 with categories: Anime Reviews, Tantei Opera Milky Holmes



I tend to complain about comedy sequels. It’s one thing to be funny, but it’s an entirely different story to be funny consistently, over a longer period of time. I really noticed that for the vast majority of these sequels, they tend to lose their inspiration, run out of their best jokes, or start trying too hard. The exceptions are there, though: there are comedy sequels who manage to beat their original: Tentai Senshi Sunred, Mitsudomoe and Fireball are examples of that. The thing is however, that the first season of Milky Holmes already was a really, really good series. And here the creators came, and improved significantly over it.

The original Milky Holmes had its weird moments as it chronicled the adventures of a group of four hilariously inept detectives, but at least it still was somewhat grounded in reality. The second season is crack. Pure crack. It makes no iota of sense, and it takes so many things along with it to the absurd. Its contents are completely bizarre from start to finish.

While parody isn’t its main focus, this show has a ton of fun pulling all sorts of references, only to make them completely ridiculous. The four lead characters have got to be the dumbest characters I have seen in a long while. In this case, it’s a compliment: you really have to try in order to be as mind-numbingly stupid as these four girls. By far the favorite form of parody of this series is taking a common trope, and completely changing its context into something completely bizarre. The result is hilarious, and this was by far my favorite comedy of the past season.

What also helps is how technically sound this series is. You wouldn’t suspect it with a team of Artland and JC Staff behind it, but the animation of this series is consistently excellent: the screen is always incredibly dynamic, this series experiments with a ton of different animation styles, and the energy just bursts from the screen in the different and numerous action sequences. The direction also is full of energy and creativity, and this creativity doesn’t run out, even though this is a sequel of a franchise totaling 24 episodes now.

Now, this series doe shave its slow moments. Because despite all the chaos, it also knows how to build up. The result is that the first halves of most episodes are relatively quiet in order to set up everything, only for this show to flick the bizarre-switch as the episode enters its second half. Don’t expect much in terms of deep characterization, though.

Storytelling: 9/10 – Hilarious; full of energy and creativity.
Characters: 8/10 – They’re very simple characters, but they remain lovable throughout the entire series.
Production-Values: 9/10 – Terrific and very dynamic animation; full of life.
Setting: 8/10 – Loves a good parody, and tears a great deal of different tropes apart.

Suggestions:
Dororon – Enma-Kun
Mitsudomoe Zouryouchuu
Ooedo Rocket

Posted on with categories: Tantei Opera Milky Holmes

That’s it? Milky Holmes are you serious in that your big ending… is a cheesy shoujo dance scene? Don’t get me wrong, I again really liked this episode, but it also was a very bizarre way to end this series with, especially with last week’s bizarre God of Lard climax. this episode pretends that nothing happened there, completely changes genre and instead makes a total mockery out of the shoujo genre.

I only have one really big complaint with this episode, and that is that it used the big comedy cliche of pulling the reset button: “our heroes have finally achieved their objectiv- oh wait, I guess not! Too bad, hahaha!” – This is something that has been pulled way too much and they’re hardly ever worth it.

Still, there was enough creativity in this episode to make up for that. It wasn’t the best episode, but as an “aftermath”, it was a neat idea to instead have the big over the top climax not at the very end.

Overall, I first noticed the director of this series, Makoto Moriwaki during his previous series, Lilpri, due to how incredibly energetic his style is. In Lilpri tis unfortunately was badly used, up to the point where all the characters did was yell at each other and the bad acting got monotone really fast. Milky Holmes has the variety and creativity that makes his style work. This season got even better with Seiya Numata behind the animation. I’d really rank this on the same level as Ben-To and Dororon Enma-Kun. It had a few weak episodes here and there, but these were totally overshadowed by the great parts.
Rating: *+ (Great)

Posted on 15 March 2012 with categories: Tantei Opera Milky Holmes

Uh guys… this was actually the penultimate episode. Why did you end with a climax here? Are you really ending this series with this? Did you intend the pig guy to be the final antagonist of this series all along? Don’t get me wrong, this episode was awesome, but it was completely different from what I expected.

Still though: this show did it again: again we’ve got ourselves a great climax for a Milky Holmes series. Both were really over the top, but the differences are… there. The first ending still took itself considerably seriously: it was an over the top and action-packed ending and knew it, ending with a great anti-climax. This though… this episode was one giant joke. This completely took the piss out of your typical anime ending.

This episode was just like your typical overblown ending, with all of the cliches there. The only thing is that the subject material was just completely bizarre. Mot final bosses are generic bosses with a ton of power that need to be taken down. Here though… we have the cast fighting a giant lard monster. It was hilarious how he tried to build up this epic atmosphere, using nothing but lard. It’s been a while since I watched something so ridiculously camp,and have it actually work out. The same kind of energy that the entire series had also worked really well with this.

The animation was interesting here. It’s the kind of episode where the budget clearly was limited, yet they try to make the best of what they have while caring nothing whatsoever about consistency. The result was an episode that had everything: still frames, bland faraway shots, fluid action scenes, very creative camera shots, actual moving cameras (which are really hard to do in anime besides the usual panning) and very creative images (seriously, give these artists an applause: they somehow managed to do the impossible and pulled off an entire episode focused on nothing but lard, and they made it look awesome).

Overall, JC Staff has the potential to become as bad as AIC and Xebec, but what sets them apart from all the other companies that focus excessively on moe is that they do put in effort to make their series actually good, and they do allow for experimentation. Or at least with a much bigger frequency than most of those other companies. And as for Artland… if there’s any company who baffles me the most, it’s got to be them. I mean, these were the guys who animated Mushishi. They made significant contributions to Legend of Galactic Heroes. And then they come with series like this. In fact, all of their moe shows are much better than usual, even though their series usually look very cheap. This was by far their best animation since Mushishi.

Also, do I want to know what next week will be about? Will that be the real ending, or some random side-story?
Rating: *** (Awesome)

Posted on 9 March 2012 with categories: Tantei Opera Milky Holmes

This show is the product of deranged minds. I… this episode… what just happened?

For some reason the intro for this episode showed different images. It turned out to be a preview for this episode. It all looked fairly normal there. but holy crap, talk about taking things out of context.

That pig guy was the single most annoying character of the second season. His speech impediment got old quite fast and I found it a bit distasteful of what they did to him. Fat people are way too often the butt of bad jokes in just about every form of entertainment out there. This episode however, took all of that to the extreme, absurd, and completely crazy by suddenly have him become the center of the show by absorbing every single Toy that Sherlock Holmes captured as a crime fighter save for one.

He then proceeds to steal all of the fat and oil from the entire city, gathers it in one place, and uses his powers to turn into some overblown bishie leaving everyone but Milky Holmes as a shriveling static electricity-prone mess. I thought that that black haired girl with that really creepy voice would steal all of them or something, after having lead Milky Holmes to it, but she only needed one of the Toys that were set free.

This pattern seems to be all over the second season: having a very dull first half in each episode, only to go completely crazy in the second half of each episode. This episode had it too: the pig guy in particular got particularly distasteful. If only I knew at the time what the creators were building up for… That’s the bizarre part of this show: it’s completely insane, yet it puts a ton of focus on building up its jokes beneath the randomness.
Rating: ** (Excellent)

Posted on 2 March 2012 with categories: Tantei Opera Milky Holmes

The premise of this episode was a bit boring, and it took a while for it to get going near the middle, though it was as bizarre as expected once it indeed took off. Kokoro is a bit of a stale character at this point, so at this point having her as the center of an episode that adds something to the entire police force except for her is a case of misplaced priorities. Still, showing the other three police girls on their days off finally shows a bit more about their characters.

The weirdest part of this episode started when the bank robbers arrived. Their character designs were just brilliantly silly considering how they tried to look like serious police officers. The weird vehicles they chose also had me in stitches. Why do bank-robbers ride on Segways and where did they get that rowboat from?

In fact, this entire episode was just full of the weirdest yet surprisingly varied character designs. That’s a problem I have with a lot of anime nowadays and of which Milky Holmes is also partially guilty: all of the characters designs and styles just look way too much like each other, especially compared to how things were around ten years ago. At the very least though, this episode contained a ton of different character designs in a ton of different styles.

Also wtf, what kind of a live concert was that?

Also also: good luck watching Saki after this.
Rating: ** (Excellent)

Posted on 24 February 2012 with categories: Tantei Opera Milky Holmes

Oh boy. The writers this week were in for a challenge: the entire premise of this episode was everyone coping with Henrietta’s betrayal last episode. That’s it. No more. This probably was the lest impressive episode so far, although it still had its hilarious parts. And considering the content humping, the creators still did their best to give such an uneventful episode energy.

What hurt this episode the most was the repetition of jokes. I mean, there’s not much you can do with a premise like this. We’ve got seven characters who each in turn turned everything that even remotely resembled a pair of giant boobs into Henrietta. The highlight of that was when they brought that camel in, but the other attempts were rather uninspired. Of course, until Cordelia went psycho and started to turn everyone into camel-humping zombies. That part was without a doubt the funniest part of this episode.

Apart from that, Kokoro was hilarious too. And then there is the cheese. Oh, the cheese. It’s been a while since I watched so overly forced cheese. Of course it was played entirely for laughs, and that at least made the second half of this episode quite entertaining.

This really is the thing about writing a good comedy: writing a good story for it. It’s a great way to prevent things from getting stale, but it is very hard to write one that actually goes somewhere, while both allowing the comedy to remain hilarious. This episode clearly chose building up over being funny, though it still tried to be funny by using its standard over the top chemistry. The big question now is: will this actually pay off? We’re still relatively far from the finale, so one boring episode doesn’t really matter… as long as it’s used well. If in the end there are even more episodes like this, then they should just have cut this episode in half and made this a 11-episode sequel. Heck, that would cost even less to make and it would actually make this show better.
Rating: * (Good)

Posted on 16 February 2012 with categories: Tantei Opera Milky Holmes

And then there were none.

Oh my god. The series has been building up to this point for quite a while now, but today, it’s finally time: this was the episode in which Henrietta finally snapped. The result is a completely action-packed episode in which she single-handedly kicks everyone’s asses in a gloriously badass episode.

This is how you do action. After about five minutes of build-up where Henrietta gets drunk on what looks like ice tea, the rest of this episode was pretty much one big action scene in which the entire cast gets beaten by the main villain when she finally stops being polite. The action was full of creativity, and especially Henriette versus her three subordinates kicked ass. Some other highlights include firing off Kokoro in order to destroy the entire school, and Henrietta getting so angry with Milky Holmes that she actually punched the entire earth. The symbolism also featured some nice touches, with the highlight being the last supper. I didn’t think that the creators would end up comparing Henriette to Jesus…

Heck, this show is pure entertainment. This is what I’m looking for in these kinds of series: the shows that really try their best to be creative and try out new visual things. Sure, it’s incredibly stupid, but I’m enjoying the hell out of this series. I do want to stress that it’s not as good as Level E last year: that one had an actually compelling story, setting and characters on top of being hilarious, while here the overall conflict and setting are quite simple. So no, it’s not going to be a comedic classic. A really entertaining roller-coaster ride though? Most definitely!
Rating: ** (Excellent)

Posted on 9 February 2012 with categories: Tantei Opera Milky Holmes

That was just amazing.

Seriously, what I just watched was without a doubt the best episode of Milky Holmes yet. I didn’t think it was possible, but this show surpassed itself yet again. It had such a simple premise, and Arsene&co weren’t involved at all here for a change. But good lord, this was a simple yet awesome idea really well executed. I really hope that other creators watch this series, because we need more episodes like this.

By far the most priceless part of the episode was the very beginning. That was just like waking up from a really bad acid trip, only to witness something even more bizarre. Kokoro waking up in that train, in the midst of everyone calmly sitting with some of the most bizarre outfits. It’s just comedic gold. The rest of the episode explaining how the heck everything happened was also just brilliant.

Also, I have no clue what Golgo of all people was doing there. But that also was just an awesome parody that the creators pulled here. The rest of this episode was also just full of the most bizarre twists, including people getting kicked off the train in some of the weirdest fashions (I also loved the reactions of the people waiting at the different stations with this). I mean, random humour is one thing, but this episode pulled so many wtf-twists that it took that to a whole different level. And yet everything was tied together due to the whole premise of this episode.

Seriously, we NEED more episodes like this. Always having these kinds of episodes would of course be too much, and would make them less special, but what I’m saying is that there should be more room for episodes to just go crazy or to play around with narrative. This just does not happen often enough. Part of the fun of storytelling is telling stories in an interesting way.
Rating: **** (Fantastic)

Posted on 3 February 2012 with categories: Tantei Opera Milky Holmes

Did they seriously devote an entire episode to streaking?

This perhaps wasn’t the most over the top episode, but it mostly stood out in how it was one of the most disturbing episodes so far. Oh, it was really fun to watch as usual. The combined idiocy of the entire cast still outshines any other series. The characters in this series give new meaning to being a moron. The animation and visual direction were as great as usual.

But yeah, this episode was full of the most bizarre streaker jokes. And it’s not like “let’s shove a streaker into the viewer’s faces a lot of times”. Instead the characters meat this bizarre girl with a multiple personality disorder who dresses like one, and for some reason beyond me end up dressing like streakers themselves later in the episode. The fanservice and also the jokes they make about it are completely bizarre. Also Arsene, WHERE THE HELL DID YOU PULL THAT WHIP OF YOURS FROM? O.o

Also, this episode understands its running jokes. This episode had several of them, and they still are hilarious due to the slight variations in the context they’re used in. The animation also still is as inspired as ever: this episode also had very good… uh…poses (I’m not referring to the streaking here! It’s just that every shot here is inspired and has a camera angle that works and has some creativity in it).
Rating: ?* (Yeah…)

Posted on 26 January 2012 with categories: Tantei Opera Milky Holmes

The big danger of this second season is the entire premise of it: the way in which the lead characters have completely forgotten how to be detectives. I mean, it’s original, but this also means that they’ll be pretty much goofing off instead of doing detective stuff. That’s what this episode was about.

Just… nothing happened here. This really was the characters goofing off on and on. They were just randomly fighting with each other, and playing Jenga of all things. For most of the first half of this episode, I thought that the creators perhaps finally lost their inspiration. And then everyone started sleeping.

The dream sequences were just hysterical. Dreams intertwining has been done before of course, but this one did it with such energy that it just immediately became funny. It was also completely absurd when people suddenly started using their Toys in order to manipulate these dreams. My favorite was turning that clock into the giant robot.

Also, near the end of the episode it also became clear that the goofing off is intentional and part of the story. It heavily hinted that this won’t be the status quo for much longer. Why they decided to turn Hercule into a closet pervert, I have no idea though.

Also, regarding the animation: I found out that Seiya Numata, on top of designing the characters, has also been promoted to the chief animation direction for this series. For the first season he only did a few episodes (which really showed by the way), but here his influence is in every single episode. It’s really great to see that after Shion no Ou he finally can show his an animation across an entire series again.

I also love how different these two series look. Shion no Ou had a limited budget and some unconventional animators, and it turned into a series that made extremely good use of this limitation by making every shot count. Milky Holmes instead has a much bigger budget, and therefore focuses more in bringing life to all of the scenes. It’s all very addictive.
Rating: ** (Excellent)

CHANGE USERNAME
Kaiser-Eoghan
Well I guess Die Farbe and whisperer in the darkness count and the cthulu one, the latter two were done by the Lovecraft society.
Kaiser-Eoghan
The closest we got with an actual adaptation was Dreams of the witchhouse , but they left out Nyarlathotep.
Kaiser-Eoghan
Those films were fun, but none of them dated well either.
Kaiser-Eoghan
I have to seperate my knowledge of the books from Stuart Gordon and Brian yuznas films that borrow elements and titles from Lovecrafts works, once I accept their takes on him are just body horror a black comedies I can kind of accept it more.
Lenlo
I think Junji Ito's manga works have come the closest to Lovecrafts brand of horror, and we all saw how that adaptation went.
Lenlo
Yeah, Lovecraft is a hard one. Even his own books are hit or miss, because it is a very fine line for his brand of psychological horror. Would make for an interesting and unique anime if done well though
Kaiser-Eoghan
A lovecraft themed world would find some difficulty in getting the atmosphere right as he has proved difficult to adapt.
Lenlo
Ah. Yeah, a non-traditional setting like that would be good. I think Isekai, to really change it up, should start going for non-traditional settings. Sci-Fi, Lovecraft, etc. I think this was mentioned before yeah?
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Lenlo: I believe the anon was saying it in relation to making a good setting for an isekai show.
Lenlo
Its why I standby Sakaki in this that, even if he was a dick about it, he is right to be angry at how it all placed out. Just not at Kurahara.

Also @Anon, I loved Bloodborne! No idea what the convo is about, but saw it mentioned
Lenlo
They should Kaiser, I agree. Just look at American college football right now. ITs coming out all over the place, and people wonder why teams dont speak out against it. Its because they are kids, they think "This is how its SUPPOSED to be. Only the best make it. Its not the coaches fault, he makes us win". etc etc.
Kaiser-Eoghan
There is a spinoff anthology for bloom into you's manga.
Kaiser-Eoghan
Or other big issues relating to sports such as performance enhancing drugs.
Kaiser-Eoghan
Lenlo, a thought popped into my head there, more sports shows should focus on abuse.
Kaiser-Eoghan
I think flipflappers is one of my favourites in years, but it was definately at its best when it wasn't really about wrapping up its story.
Amagi
Space Dandy and Kaiba had this to some degree too. Liked both series.
Amagi
@Kaiser: Kinda sad that the latter half of Flip Flappers was rather weak because it started with this different worlds idea.
Amagi
I think Matsumoto stuff might actually be the very first anime I have seen in my life, not regularly though and usually when I was in Italy.
Kaiser-Eoghan
The noir world could be in black and white.
Kaiser-Eoghan
How about another world that has different sections that follow different genres?
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Anon: Helped greatly by his use of artistic cinematography and use of dramatic stills.
Anonymous3316528
Old anime has very bitter stories. Despite the old drawings, several had harsh live lessons. Osamu Dezaki had such a talent to direct drama.
Kaiser-Eoghan
I need to actually watch that Leiji Matsumoto stuff some day.
Anonymous3316528
Also Galaxy Express 99 I think also treated that topic.
Anonymous3316528
@Kaiser-Eoghan Wasn't that Gate?
Anonymous3316528
Just like how Gundam made one for the Vietnam War.
Kaiser-Eoghan
A proper story dealing with isekai and immigration crisis.
Anonymous3316528
I mean they could make an allegory of the Berlin Wall.
Anonymous3316528
So Papers Please the anime?
Kaiser-Eoghan
I think a romance themed isekai involving borders and beraucracy getting in the way could work.
Kaiser-Eoghan
I liked those czech Jules verne animations.
Anonymous3316528
I suppose the work for creating assets for new settings it's why they don't do it. Most Isekai seem like they can take a tree, or a house from previous works and just change them a little.
Anonymous3316528
On second thought, that was technically the Anastasia animated movie.
Anonymous3316528
@Kaiser-Eoghan - Yeah. Just take the roadmap Bloodborne put out. It's even the perfect setting for an antihero archetype, considering these settings are about the hunt, surviving and superstition. I'll also like the Russia setting, harsh weather, espionage, travelling through train, boat and land like Jules Verne's Ivan Strogoff
Kaiser-Eoghan
That time I got reincarnated in the Soviet union.
Kaiser-Eoghan
I'd love to see an anime set in Russia.
Kaiser-Eoghan
Gothic horror or industrial if only for liking the genre. I still want my anime western.
Anonymous3316528
All in all as I always say. I want new settings, steampunk, western, egyptian, chinese, space, nuclear dystopian, castaway, underwater, skyworld, gothic horror. Or any other tired trope other than european medieval fantasy.
Kaiser-Eoghan
Hmmm, with the nostalgia of old games undertale went for, but without the maudlin di7alogue.
Anonymous3316528
Or something like Mad Max or the RPG series it inspired Metal Max. Maybe another one inspired by Phantasy Star.
Anonymous3316528
I got it! What if someone makes an Isekai on the vein of Earthbound or Undertale. I mean most are influenced by the standard fantasy JRPG. So why not take from the less typical ones?
Kaiser-Eoghan
Just for the novelty of it, I would like to see an anime about a relationship between un-traditional/un-usual couples that we never see.
Kaiser-Eoghan
Maybe that'd be cheesy or something but they manage to form new friendship/families which allow them to put behind what they lost.
Amagi
I like semi-episodical series that have an episodical plot and a golden thread at the same time, the latter usually being more subtile or like a subplot and each episodical adventure gives the audience a few new hints or informations about the setting, characters or main plot.
Kaiser-Eoghan
I wouldn't even mind a drama driven otherworld story about a depressed person trying to move on and the new world actually helping them move past that.
Kaiser-Eoghan
So how about my don-quixhote anime Japan =)
Kaiser-Eoghan
But at the same time there's a bunch of serious stuff, but its not clashing with the lighthearted stuff badly.
Kaiser-Eoghan
My favourite type of adventure story though are the ones where its more about the journey and hangout, sometimes the story appears here and there. And its usually centred around three goofballs with alot of chemistry.
Amagi
Sadly there never is any culture clash or culture shock either, speaking of the LN/game mechanic isekai here. The isekai people are just like the people of nowadays Japan but with swords and magic, basically. Maybe a few rituals at best.
Amagi
An isekai should be like King of Thorns despite KoT not being an actual isekai. But awakening in another world, not understanding anything, exploring, mysteries and slowly piecing things together that make the MC understand the logic of that new world a bit better while trying to integrate into the foreign culture.
Amagi
@Kaiser/Anon: I feel like that too. I love explore and isekai would be perfect for exploration and yet it's always about the MC finding his place as soon as he got teleported, he finds his crew, friends, house, power and so on.
Amagi
@Anon: You're right I watched a few scenes, the dub actually fits pretty well to Nanbaka. The series itselfs is too insane for me I guess.
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Anon: Lack of journey, focuses too much on harem/romcom bits.
Amagi
I have yet to watch Voltron. The animation looks somewhat weird to me but everything else I heard about it so far sounds pretty good.
Lenlo
I welcome the essays Kaiser! Sakaki is a much more complex character than I expected, and Animosh is right that it doesnt justify his actions. I didnt mean to imply that. I do think however that Sakaki is not wrong to be angry. He is just directing it at the wrong person.
Anonymous3316315
@Kaiser-Eoghan - In what sense? In that it isn't a journey? A quest? A series of trials? The hunt of ancient treasure? Or whatever dimension hoping happens in Milk Closet?
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Animosh: Well said about Sakaki's character and I agree with you on it. Saves me writing an essay response now.
Kaiser-Eoghan
Tangent, but I want to say something, one of the most annoying things about LNs is when they do the isekai thing, the other world almost never feels like an adventure.
Kaiser-Eoghan
And I honestly wouldn't complain if it was full blown yuri or shoujo-ai.
Anonymous3316315
@Kaiser-Eoghan - A lot of series have hard ship baiting. Voltron, She Ra, Seraph of the End, Korra (which at the last second they did it). I know sometimes is a stretch like Frodo and Sam in LotR or Venom and Eddie. But other times it's that relationship in everything but name.
Kaiser-Eoghan
People seem to play up the shoujo-ai thing in Euphonium.
Anonymous3316315
@Amagi - Nanbaka has a good English dub. They knew the delivery had to be as hammy as possible.
Kaiser-Eoghan
I'm looking forward to those Gundam NT films.
Kaiser-Eoghan
I didn't finish violet evergarden nor did I watch tsurune. In the priors case, that was something I would have seen myself liking maybe 10 years ago.
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Amagi: I liked Koe no kitachi aswell.
Kaiser-Eoghan
We can call it Racing Lads.
Amagi
Okay thanks. I can deal with slow pacing as long as there is an atmosphere or good character story.
Kaiser-Eoghan
Free and kaze cross over WHEN!
Kaiser-Eoghan
I liked how scaled back it was.
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Amagi: I think you were asking about the new kyoani movie earlier? I can't remember if I posted about it on here what I thought, but I actually liked it more than the main Euphonium series, it stood out in its adherence to using body language, silence and movements moreso than dialogue while giving me a coming of age movie I had been asking for. Though some won't like the glacial pacing
Amagi
KazeGa is pretty damn good. It kinda feels like it actually is what Kyoani is always trying to do when they produce sport series with a male cast that are half comedy half drama. But while I often like some aspects of Kyoani shows (like the setting and themes of VEG), I never like the execution, save from the looks of course that are awesome but don't help making the content any better.
Amagi
*above
Amagi
@SuperMario: IIRC mosts Steven Universe VAs are actual singers so they should be a level about typical VAs anyway. Not sure who's voice acting for RWBY.
Amagi
But since I watch everything seasonally subs are faster and I usually don't rewatch series, otherwise a rewatch could be a good reason to watch the dubs for the second time.
Amagi
At least eng dubs got way better in general over the yers. Probably because anime is more mainstream now. Maybe I would like many of them more if I started with the dub.
SuperMario
Maybe it’s a translation issue, by that I mean usually some nuance from the native language is lost in translation. That issue can be alright if it subs, but when saying it out loud it becomes unnatural?
Amagi
Japanese VAs also talk a lot about their characters and give interviews about them, including their own interpretations or head canon stuff. Not sure if western VAs of Japanese shows do that too.
Amagi
Instead when it's a foreign show there is nothing to do but to memorize the finished lines and everything is already set in stone, so you are 100% passive and can't really view it as your or your team's work.
Amagi
I often heard that western VAs thought up some ideas that were integrated into the script. Not sure if that's the case for most cartoons of if these were exceptions, but it could be a hint that VAs are way more involved into a show and the development of their characters when it is a native show, it's kinda logical.
Amagi
Yeah, native stuff is usually better.
SuperMario
Then again, I enjoy the English VA of western cartoon like RWBY or Steven Universe so I guess it’s just a matter of original intended language for me
SuperMario
Well, I’m not a fan of dubbing either. Not that much of a dub-hater but I remember watching Monster and Cowboy Bebop in english dub before I had to switch back to Japanese voice midway through
Amagi
Still living ones I mean. But as said actual movies are usually well dubbed, so I guess it depends on how much money something generates.
Amagi
I knew a bunch of old ones but they're all dead by now. Know maybe three or so with name and face (and often don't even recognize them in movies) and another 6-10 by name only.
Amagi
@Kaiser: To be honest I never know any actors no matter how well known they are.
Kaiser-Eoghan
Is it awkward hearing a famous actor you associate too much with a certain role, voicing an anime character?
Kaiser-Eoghan
Also, what is the stance on professional well known film actors voicing anime movie dubs?
Kaiser-Eoghan
Now....I'm sure no-one likes the animax or hong-kong English dubs =)
Kaiser-Eoghan
On fandubs, the English voice actress for Madoka Kaname was originally a youtube fandubber. Also A fandub of happy sugar lifes first episode exists.
Amagi
Didn't know that exists. Fandubbers. Hm.
Kaiser-Eoghan
As in there are Russian fandubbers doing this.
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Amagi: Because I have to really really dig for the obscure stuff I watch, sometimes I end up accidently downloading Fandubs of these films.
Kaiser-Eoghan
I suppose in the case of the hentai dubbing example, part of it and I don't watch this to come off as rascist, but the noises the Japanese voice actors make....
Amagi
When I hear "really bad dubs" it always reminds me of these old USSR dubs where one guy voices all characters.
Kaiser-Eoghan
Even though its a semi-dead language, I am actually wondering what an anime would sound like dubbed in Irish.
Amagi
I usually also always prefer the original language with dub. Luckily, indie production movies and movies that aren't from America are often shown subbed here. Probably because it's just less work since these movies don't make much money.
Kaiser-Eoghan
Although as I said 1960s dubs are horrible.
Kaiser-Eoghan
I can't watch live action films English dubbed, especially European ones.
Amagi
@Kaiser: Good question. If there are anime where susb could actually hinder immersion. Never really thought about this.
Amagi
I mean life action movies have almost always excellent dubs no matter with western language. It's just that anime were kinda negleted for a long time. I guess Netflix dubs for anime are way better than anime dubs years ago. Especially for their original series. Watched them with subs though so not sure.
Kaiser-Eoghan
Now that brings that something else, if I was to watch a hentai anime or something sensual, I might actual find it more connectable if it was in my own language.
Kaiser-Eoghan
I live in a world where neither I nor Aidan were permitted to dub the voice of the Lancer servant in fate.
Animosh
@Kaiser: yeah, I read that in the "About Our Site" thingy. It's a shame he's no longer around.
Amagi
@Kaiser: That porn thing is actually a good idea.
Amagi
Our dubs are usually pretty bad though. And I hate how they're always using the same few VAs. Most of them don't have any qualifications or anything, they're not even actors. Just some random dudes that applied for the job and you can really notice that.
Kaiser-Eoghan
Now heres a thing....there have been cases where hentai anime has been English dubbed using porn actors.
Amagi
@Kaiser: For whatever reason there is no Ger dub for Monster, which is a wasted opportunity.
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Amagi: Utaprince is the only non-shit one by virtue of being absolutely shit.
Amagi
@Kaiser: never heard that before but that sounds right. I was never sure if the inability to listen without starting to daydream was an autistical thing or coincidence. I never have any concentration problems with written stuff, even if it's boring.
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Amagi: I can't wait for people to assume the fruits basket remake is an otome VN adaption when it airs.
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Animosh: Just like psgels.
Amagi
@Kaiser: Funny enough those series always sell better too. Tiger and Bunny had a lot of fujo fans and non-fujo female fans that bought it whereas otome sell rather badly afaik. And the great seeling bishiboys-onlys are usually adaption of games that sell well for already having a big fanbase or because the BDs contain some game code. Like with Grandblue and the likes.
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Amagi: I've heard that even when watching films in our own languages, we autistic people have an easier time watching stuff in our own language when subtitles in our own language are turned on.
Animosh
@Kaiser: I'm Dutch, actually! Although I live somewhere else in Europe right now.
Kaiser-Eoghan
I probably typed way too much so its better I say something short such as: I'm on the middle ground.
Amagi
Watched it mainly on Japanese again but in that case it was really just due to my listening/concentration problem.
Kaiser-Eoghan
I suppose ambiguous bromances are a form of male fanservice.
Amagi
@Kaiser: I agree that the Dandy dub was one of the few good examples I know. The series felt quite western too.
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Animosh: Somewhere in my head for some reason I thought you were American.
Amagi
The characters themselves also seem worse for most of the time. Maybe because there are way more pandering anime for males, so you have to be at least somewhat creative there whereas otome shows are rather rare. The fans of that will buy it no matter how bad it is.
Animosh
And in some cases dubs are clearly the better option for me. For example, I've always watched FLCL dubbed because of how much is happening on screen. But I'm so used to reading subs now that it almost never ruins my immersion in a series. Perks of being a non-native speaker I guess. I've grown up with subs.
Kaiser-Eoghan
Now...I wonder if Italian dubs for gunslinger girl exist, or a French dub of Chevalier d'eon or rose of versaille.
Amagi
@Kaiser: Yeah. Bishounen shows seem to be cheaper in general. Aidan mentioned that a lot of times and I agree. It's not a preference thing (IMO). Otome and mass bishounen shows seem to be generally worse than normal harem/idol stuff.
Kaiser-Eoghan
Sometimes a western setting a dub might work better for me.
Amagi
When Japanese was a completely foreign language to me. But the more I understood Japanese the more I prefered the original VAs. I remember that I liked the western dubs of Noir back then and when I listened to them again 10 years later I was horrified.
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Amagi: A good example is that both in English and Japanese, bishounen shows don't have good voice acting.
Animosh
I think it's partly just a matter of what you're used to though. I grew up with the English dub of DBZ, and as a result I just can't stand Goku's old lady voice.
Amagi
@Aidan: Regarding the not-understanding theory I think the main reason for why I don't believe this that I was actually fine with western dubs at the beginning - around 2003 or so.
Amagi
@Kaiser: Could be. Maybe because people tend to deepen their voice when they're bored or something. So you don't notice it that much when there is a higher voice. I can't remember any female VA that sounded boring. Maybe bad, but not bored
Animosh
I tend to prefer subs too. Other than the quality of voice acting I think it can also help with suspension of disbelief. When characters speak English it becomes a lot harder to ignore how silly or cartoonish their lines can be. I have the same issue with live action adaptations. It just ruins suspension of disbelief for me.
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Amagi: And in case there's an odd accent in there somewhere.
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Amagi: Now, heres something interesting, for English language films I turn on English language subtitles, not out of hearing issues, but so I can remember names better and the dialogue sinks in better.
Amagi
The listening problem makes it impossible for me to watch youtube stuff too unless the videos are less then 5 minutes long. I am just unable to halt my own thoughts so my mind always drifts away and I miss half of the things people say.
Kaiser-Eoghan
Also as a side note, does anyone else notice that with male voice actors, it can be more easier to pinpoint when they are disinterested in the material?
Kaiser-Eoghan
My preference for watching anime when marathoning, is to switch back and forth between languages. I’ll watch episode 1 in Japanese, the second in English, third in Japanese, repeat that process until I finish the show.
It gives me more to talk about and do compare and contrastings if I were to ever do up a review of my own.
Kaiser-Eoghan
On the subject of Japanese and English voice actors, I think in both cases, while I like the current pool of actors, new blood on both sides is something I wish would happen.
Kaiser-Eoghan
Granted I still watch them in Italian, because those old 60s English dubs are horrendous.
Do I believe that screenings should offer both dubbed and subtitled screenings from anime films, yes? For the variety.
Kaiser-Eoghan
Sometimes as I said, an English voice actor can successfully camp up the material when its camp originally and that’s an improvement.
I watch A LOT of old martial arts films from the 60s and Eurocop films, all of them, especially the Italian ones, even if you watch them in Italian are post production dubbed.
Kaiser-Eoghan
Some dubs actually make the effort to get the accents right such as Hellsing and Baccano.
I have no problems reading subtitles (unless in some cases of very very polemical dialectical French political rant Marxist films but in that case I can always pause/rewind).
Animation allows for an easier, more comfortable dubbing process in any language due to being able to get the lip syncing right.
Kaiser-Eoghan
This is my general view on dubbing: I do not approve of censorship or elaborate changes in general to the original material.
When it comes to dubs for animated media, the older ones are generally not professional, but can be amusing, in anime cases I believe that since those 90s dubs, there have been improvements.
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Amagi: The only advantage Hellsings tv version has over the ova is the music.
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Amagi: They actual got British accents for it.
Kaiser-Eoghan
I think if you're not watching something twice, then you've not watched it.
Amagi
@Kaiser: Was Hellsing especially good or bad? I can only vaguely remember the series. Think I never finished it. I am a fan of the OVA though.
Amagi
Reading is just easier than listen. It's one of the reasons why I watch way more anime than life action which is usually dubbed and therefore way harder to follow for me.
Amagi
Aside from that I think I just prefer subs on a personal level since I have a problem concentrating when it's about listening. Never could do that in university either and always read that stuff up in books.
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Amagi: I don't get to watch Hellsing dubbed in German so I'm sad now.
Amagi
If you don't believe me you have to listen to Steins;Gate, it's terrible. Not saying that all are bad though. But the big mayority and the few good ones are uninteresting since you watched the anime with the original voices earlier so it never makes sense to switch since you're already associating the characterse with the JP voices.
Amagi
@Aidan: Not sure if it's really the language alone. Anime dubs of languages I barely understand or don't understand at all are usually weaker too. It's just that Japanese VA are usually profs, some of them with a pretty good voice range, whereas western dubbers are random people. At least it's that way in Germany, English dubs are usuall better than German ones but weaker than Japanese.
AidanAK47
@Anon, I wouldn't consider that a myth. I genuinely get more immersed in anime watching it dubbed than subbed. I feel that regardless on how fast you get at reading subtitles you still miss things on screen and it's a constant reminder on screen stopping a show from drawing you in as much as it could.
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